Irk
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[C01:ffffff]
Posts: 459
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Post by Irk on Nov 1, 2009 2:00:32 GMT -8
'Grats once again, Sil.
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Post by black_dragonet on Nov 1, 2009 2:04:33 GMT -8
Actually, I find it logical. Splinters stand for chaos, when Nightwatch stands for order. That the two oppose is logical, even if I would not fight this fight that way.
In a way, Nightwatch and Splinters should have the same views on blood level: It is only a tool to be wasted in the pursuit of their higher goal. What seems stupid in our shoes is something they just feel compelled to do.
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Damia
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Posts: 186
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Post by Damia on Nov 1, 2009 19:24:50 GMT -8
Congratulations to yet another splinter on achieving death.
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Silhouette
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Eclipsed[C01:FFFFFF]
Posts: 160
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Post by Silhouette on Nov 2, 2009 4:33:54 GMT -8
I think the idea there, (and indeed of a large proportion of what we do) would be to point out that having no pints of blood doesn't equate to death. But thank you anyway.
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Liander
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Lead me, follow me, or get out of my way.
Posts: 430
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Post by Liander on Nov 2, 2009 6:11:55 GMT -8
Splinters > NightWatch
That is all.
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Vex
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Psychotic[C01:FFFFFF]
Posts: 489
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Post by Vex on Nov 2, 2009 10:44:51 GMT -8
But having no pints of blood does mean that you have to waste time gaining a bit of blood to be able to fulfill your contracts.
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Silhouette
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Eclipsed[C01:FFFFFF]
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Post by Silhouette on Nov 2, 2009 11:08:42 GMT -8
I didn't say that this wasn't the case, it's blindingly obvious. Being 'adopted' as it were, still holds no real bearing on our core philosophic beliefs though, it's just inconvenient.
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Idony
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IGN: Idony | OOC: Cora
Posts: 1,581
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Post by Idony on Nov 2, 2009 11:53:06 GMT -8
Strictly speaking, they're only half our contracts. The other half belongs to the contractors, who have grudges or lulz to itch. At the end of the night, it's more to their disadvantage than ours But at least neither of us is pissing coin against the wall, so who's the party doing the wasting?
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Post by Jean DeVenn on Nov 2, 2009 12:09:24 GMT -8
First of all, congratulations to Silhouette for achieving the zeroing you wanted, and to the NightWatch for doing it.
The question of whether it's a waste of NightWatch resources really comes down to one of objectives.
NightWatch and Splinters both have finite resources, replenished from a variety of sources. The Splinters' goal is to make money and inspire fear by carrying out contracts. The NightWatch's goal is to prevent the Splinters doing so, on the grounds that a Splinters contract is unjust in that it allows for no opportunity to negotiate with the contractor, provides no reason for the contract being taken out, and by not identifying the contractor allows no action to be taken against that party.
Thus, if the NightWatch or some other group is able to keep the Splinters at zero, their goal is achieved. If the Splinters are able to carry out contracts (with or without necro - I'm unclear what the philosophy on that is), then the Splinters achieve their objective and frustrate that of the NightWatch.
As I recall, when TiC initiated the original "Adopt a Twig" programme, it succeeded to the point where the Splinters ceased to be active until recently. Whether the current programme will succeed really depends on whether the city at large considers the benefit of the service the Splinters offer outweighs the risk of themselves being on the receiving end of a contract. It also depends, I feel, on whether the Splinters maintain their traditional secrecy on who has been buying contracts, and also maintain public perception that their stance is strictly neutral in terms of the contracts they accept.
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Andre
New Member
Silhouette's Shadow
Posts: 190
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Post by Andre on Nov 2, 2009 14:17:56 GMT -8
Firstly, may I say it's nice to see you walking the streets again, Jean. It's been a while.
The issue I have, though, is with your reasoning. You see, the Nightwatch have only targeted a handful of the Gekkonid membership. I, myself, have yet to feel their holy water even though I spend most nights in the company of Silhouette there, and was present both times she has been brought to zero by the Nightwatch. Keeping a fraction of the membership at zero will do nothing, ultimately, but destroy their stocks of coin. The rest of us can keep on doing contracts and getting paid. Those under the level at which you can use weapons... well, they won't be using any, so they won't, in fact, be losing any coin at all, and neither will the rest of us. However. The same can't be said of the Nightwatch keeping them at zero.
And this is what it all comes down to. We Gekkonids are losing nothing but blood, which is unimportant in itself. I think I'm right in saying that, judging by public reacting, the Nightwatch have lost more than just coin in this one.
This is entirely wrong, I am afraid. For starters, it is widely stated that we do not make a profit on contracts - so how, then, are we to make money?
As for inspiring fear... We believe strongly that being drained of blood is not death. To enforce an un-natural code on ourselves in order to appease a flawed sense of honor, is foolishness. Blood, as the quotation goes, is not an aspect of power. Your blood, in the day to day workings of the city, has no value. No worth. Can you not move with no pints drunk? Of course you can. So, then, you have not endured final death.
We do not aim to inspire fear, no. We aim to inspire those of our kindred whom we encounter to look at us, see we have transcended such pettiness, and start to question if what they have believed to this point about 'power' within the city is actually as right as they thought...
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Post by Jean DeVenn on Nov 2, 2009 15:30:29 GMT -8
Thank you Andre, you've helped clarify a number of points. If I have misunderstood the Splinters, then it is possible others have, as well. The chances are that not everyone has looked up the fine details of how you operate - I can see I'll need to do that !
There are a couple of thing that still concern me, however. Although you may not set out to inspire fear, that (combined with anger) is indubitably the effect you have in your victims. Just as importantly, it is likely to be a strong motivation for those who hire you, letting it be known that they can strike with impunity as often as they wish or can afford.
The other thing is that although you may not value blood (and indeed, for me I regard it primarily as a tool), there are those in the city who do, and who struggle hard to gain it over long periods of time, at least in enough quantity to be able to function in clan wars and the like. I'm something of a libertarian, and find the enforcement of a specific philosophy on others somewhat uncomfortable.
None of this detracts from the courage of Silhouette and her comrades who have fallen. That is not in issue. I'd just personally be a little happier if the victims had a route to understand the details of why they were being targetted, and an opportunity to negotiate (however indirectly) with those who have caused this.
One final question, if I may: am I right in thinking the Splinters when they first formed only hit vampires who did not go into torpor on losing all blood, but that this policy no longer applies and all except vampires with the power of Neutrality are now considered fair targets ?
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Post by Jean DeVenn on Nov 2, 2009 15:34:04 GMT -8
Apolgies, Andre. I should have added; if you prefer to answer in a private letter to prevent our conversation derailing Silhouette's obituary, I'd be more than happy with that. ((OOC - or if you're coming into London in a couple of week's time for the get-together, I'll buy you a beer and you can tell me all about it ))
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Leigh
New Member
Baby, go back to your life and I'll go back to mine...IGN: xXLeighXx | OOC: Kayla
Posts: 54
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Post by Leigh on Nov 2, 2009 16:47:54 GMT -8
Congrats, Sil.
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Valiant
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I'll be the one to punch your lights out.
Posts: 102
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Post by Valiant on Nov 2, 2009 19:53:29 GMT -8
Haha. Congrats
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PoisonIvy
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Dead and Buried[C01:FFFFFF]
Posts: 108
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Post by PoisonIvy on Nov 2, 2009 20:10:11 GMT -8
One final question, if I may: am I right in thinking the Splinters when they first formed only hit vampires who did not go into torpor on losing all blood, but that this policy no longer applies and all except vampires with the power of Neutrality are now considered fair targets ? We still hold true to that practice, however, with the addition of the Battle Cloak it made it very clear on who rests and who doesn't. If a non-Battle cloaked player comes to us and tells us they don't want anything to do with us, period end of story, then we can make a note of that. I said this same thing on NightWatch, but it was obviously overlooked. The only issue with this is, a-You would need to do so before you have a contract on yourself and b-If you choose this option you will have NO interaction with us on an IC level at all. You essentially will not exist. And if at any point in time we find out that you havn't been resting then your open for contracts again. If you truly feel that you will always rest. Always use the rules about Torpor set so long ago. Then come to us and we will set something up for you. But That doesn't mean come to us saying "I only rest I swear" because as soon as you don't your open again and we don't have to tell you if we find out you havn't rested that your open again. You would just find out when and if you got a contract on you. If you have openly stated that you don't rest before, you don't qualify. If you haven't rested before, you don't qualify.
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