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Post by Dr. Nash Fang on Nov 13, 2008 8:29:30 GMT -8
Dear Dr. Nash Fang,
Obviously, I have a problem that I need advice with: My childer hate each other. I know it's natural for siblings to have a few arguments and bicker over who's right and who's wrong, but they'd fight to almost violent extents if it weren't for their friends or myself.
They've met only a small handful of times, and they have all ended with someone angry and threatening violence. Both are too stubborn to apologize to one another and if they do, it will be with sarcasm and a condescending tone. If they're going to be apologetic, may as well be sincere.
Anyway, I was just wondering if it would be a better idea to ask them to ignore each other forever, tell them to ignore each other and hope that time will cool them down enough to actually have a civil conversation and settle there differences, or something else entirely?
Sincerely, Distressed and in a fret.
Dear Distressed:
Remember that these siblings are also (supposedly) mature vampires, even though they may be acting more like spoiled human brats in this instance. Many vampires feel that violence is the way to solve their issues, and if that’s not an option, they don’t know how to behave.
Is there a root to the problem? For example: did you sire one well before the other? Sometimes, an only childer can feel threatened by the addition of others to the bloodline. Do they belong to different clans, and perhaps are having trouble balancing family vs. clan? If you know what the start of the problem was, perhaps they can work on it. However, that means they have to be willing to do so.
Now, I know it’s too late for you on this particular bit of advice, but for my readers out there who are considering siring someone: think about the mix of personalities. Can the new childe adapt to the hoards of childer you already have, or vice versa? I strongly suggest that whenever someone is added to the lineage, it not be a surprise. That doesn’t mean that your childer get to dictate who you sire, but it will help smooth over any hard feelings if they get to meet before the siring.
As to what you can do in this situation, Distressed: if they are truly that stubborn, don’t try to force them to apologize. As you’ve seen, it isn’t sincere. You either wait until they work it out themselves, or if you can’t handle their issues, there’s always the Hall of Severance. You might also see if they can discuss their problems with an uninvolved, unrelated third party.
Whatever you do, try not to give the appearance that you are siding with one over the other. It’s their argument, best if you stay well away from it.
Sincerely,
Dr. Nash Fang
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Idony
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IGN: Idony | OOC: Cora
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Post by Idony on Nov 13, 2008 9:45:24 GMT -8
This has actually been a problem mostly concerning children, who just don't get on - yes, I'm talking of humans. There's even been experiments to try to see into the problem and figure out general solutions.
One of the best things you could do is try to get them to work together over something. Something serious; with humans, it was a cart bringing food that got stuck. You, as a sire with childer like that, should make a problem for all of them, and it should force them to either work together or suffer serious consequences if the problem continues.
Another thing that works wonders is a war. Similar to my advice up there... A war is taking it too far admittedly as it can have complications, and if they're in separate clans, forget it. But there's little bonding like that done during war... You could, however, bring them together for all of you to talk etc, find people all of you hate and just... beat up on them, verbally amongst yourselves. Make them feel they have something in common or feel the same way about something and laugh at the same things.
My, that's vicious advice, isn't it? >.> At least it's an idea... And better than having to sever. If you can make things work, then that's admirable. But in the worst case...
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Post by Katastrophe St. John-Talon on Nov 13, 2008 10:21:06 GMT -8
Is it just me, or do the emotions we have as vampires seem to be more amplified than those we had as humans? Sorry, not exactly on topic there, but I just got to thinking about it. Anyway... As Idony mentioned, this problem exists in humans as well, and like Dr. Fang says, it's important to discuss and involve current members of a lineage (or family) with the happenings. It keeps those already a part of the lineage involved, and makes them feel important. I'm not saying to give them a say in the matter, necessarily, because if they don't like it, they can go spend their coins and spill their blood and be on their way, if that's how far they want to take it. For myself, I don't think I recall ever not getting along with a sibling, with the one exception being Deylin not being crazy about me when I first became his sister. I'd like to think we worked things out though as he was mostly disgruntled that I didn't choose him as my sire at the time... as well he should've been because the fault was mine that I couldn't make up my blasted mined, but I digress. I also recall being in a family I loved and suddenly gaining a new sibling by surprise. I didn't have a problem with this sibling in the least, but I disliked it being kept from me as if my involvement didn't matter in the least. Keeping that in mind, if and when I sire more childer, I will always involve the ones that are currently in my line. It's like that little song, "Make new friends, but keep the old; one is silver and the other gold." If you're going to bring more into the family, make sure you're able to keep the ones you have... if at all possible. Thinking again about these childer who aren't getting along... my hope is that they aren't disrespecting their sire as a result of their disgruntled feelings on the matter. And I'm rambling now... Oh, and by the way, I love my sisters.
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Elektra
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Obsession. Compulsion. Perfection.[C01:Grey]
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Post by Elektra on Nov 13, 2008 12:04:07 GMT -8
Idony's right about the war thing. ;D
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rel
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byrren jous ninta yibinss wun ninta xo'a ulu kl'ae vel'bol zhah udosst..er'griff l' seke ph' shebali
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Post by rel on Nov 13, 2008 16:59:26 GMT -8
I've always wondered why they have to get along. I find it far more fascinating when they remain bloodline regardless of their personal feelings towards each other.
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Post by Katastrophe St. John-Talon on Nov 13, 2008 17:16:35 GMT -8
Yeah, but if they are causing their sire unnecessary stress, then I can see where it becomes a bit of an annoyance.
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Post by deaths embrace on Nov 13, 2008 17:38:31 GMT -8
Having been in this exact situation, there is but one thing for it. Tell them if they can not say anything nice to each other, let the HW fly. If there is a "No Hwing" rule let the swords be drawn and let them try to kill each other. They are vampyres, steel can not kill them. Sounds like they need to learn who the top dog really is.
The Sire should mediate the fight, and what brings a Family together more than a Wake? Drink and be merry over the body of the one who sleeps, more power to the top pyre.
My Sire even went so far as to handcuff us together, it did not have the effect he intended. In my Family, we are Sisters, yet, the only cohesive element is our Sire. Is it a problem? No, we each have our strengths and our weaknesses, but we are still blood. If our Sire called us to battle we would be there. As long as these Chylder are loyal to the Sire, there is no need to actually "like" each other.
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Idony
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Post by Idony on Nov 13, 2008 18:56:18 GMT -8
Liking is one thing; being polite is another. Think how bad it would look if these days, with papers all over the place, two childer of the same sire would be at each other's throats? Certainly wouldn't look good. The fact that efficiency is the only true essential is something I agree with though, come to think of it...
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Post by Katastrophe St. John-Talon on Nov 13, 2008 19:34:07 GMT -8
Haven't we seen that happen before, though?
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Post by deaths embrace on Nov 14, 2008 7:45:45 GMT -8
Liking is one thing; being polite is another. Think how bad it would look if these days, with papers all over the place, two childer of the same sire would be at each other's throats? Certainly wouldn't look good. The fact that efficiency is the only true essential is something I agree with though, come to think of it... Why would it not "look good"? Would it be an embarassment to the Sire? If so, then the Sire needs to take a good look at how they run their line, if they feel they can not keep their own Chylder in line. Is it supposed to look bad for the Chylde? If everyone is a "yes man" all the time, then no new ideas are created. Passions either angry and seductive are what makes this eternity something worthy of continuing. The Sire should just be happy that the Chylder actually have enough fire to stand up to each other. This milktoast mentality of "Romper Room" togetherness is why this city seems to be falling into a miasma of ambivalence. This Sire either needs to realize that tthe Chylder ... 1)Need a HW bath from the Sire whenever the Chylder can not be taken out in public . 2)Need a HW bath from each other to finally figure out which one has the stones to uphold their own opinion 3)Let the Chylder be who they are and let the city sort them out if their mouths get them in trouble. or 4)Sever the Chylder and start over, that way the Sire does not have to feel the angst of their behavior.
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Idony
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Post by Idony on Nov 14, 2008 8:41:53 GMT -8
Not everyone shares that mentality and to generalise is most often, as I said a while ago to another person, erroneous :P I said it would look bad because the family would seem divided. I disagree that the childer should get a HW from the sire. That should only be applied if the childer doesn't listen... Or at least it's what I would do. But then again, I wouldn't sire someone if I knew them to be unstable, or not at least manageable. Same with the severance. You took the childe in, deal with the consequences of your not having thought things carefully enough.
Some go about it the physical way, some the cerebral. So long as it works, to each their own. But I would be surprised if the general public wouldn't look down on an apparently hectic bloodline.
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Itami
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[C01:CCFFFF]
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Post by Itami on Nov 14, 2008 17:27:51 GMT -8
So this isn't exactly on topic, seeing as how I don't have any siblings to speak of, but reading through this has made me want to address one of the fears I've had for a while now.
Uri has been thinking about siring another vampire, meaning I'd have a sister. I didn't think I would ever have a problem having siblings, I've had them before, but this is different. My sire would be siring someone else, someone that isn't me. I've been Daddy's Baby Boy for so long that I'm honestly not sure how I would handle it. In fact, if you haven't noticed, I'm already on a edge a bit just thinking about it.
It was bad enough when my Sire got married and I was no longer his only one, but I've gotten over that because being married makes him happy and that's what I want. But to throw in another childe? I'm already fully aware of one of the future childer, and I'm perfectly comfortable with them. But a sister? I just don't know.
And I know I sound completely selfish right now, but that's just how I feel about it. He wouldn't want me to pretend; and I don't want to either. I know it's something that has been on my mind a lot lately, after someone asked me about it. So I suppose the only thing left to do now is to go and discuss it with him. Mmm, wish us luck.
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Jenny
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It's makes a dreadfully ugly child, but a rather handsome pig, I think.[C01:olive]
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Post by Jenny on Nov 14, 2008 18:10:19 GMT -8
This talk of sibling rivalry is foreign to me, at least.
My sister and I were the best of friends before Vera sired us and becoming blood sisters just strengthened that bond, immortalized it.
If my sire were to take another childe, I probably would have an issue with it at first, of course. There's always possessiveness, but it probably wouldn't be fair to that sired childe, 'cause my sister and I wouldn't be too close with it.
I don't think any wars would be started over though. No, ... I know there wouldn't be.
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Bambi
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Post by Bambi on Nov 15, 2008 2:17:48 GMT -8
I ain't got any siblings now which is probably a good thing cos firstly, I ain't a good role model for anyone younger then me and if anyone older then me tried to baby me I'd take great pleasure in ripping off their head and shoving it up their arse... but I digress.
*folds his left arm across his stomach and cup his right elbow, tapping his chin thoughtfully for a moment with his right index finger*
I think the main cause for this so called sibling rivalry is that a lot of vampire lines create a false sense of family. When I was in a line where I wasn't the only childe, there was a lot of jealousy and in-fighting due to everyone wanting to be the favourite child in the eyes of their parent. Yer'll note I said child and parent rather then childe and sire as that is how the vampire line was set up. If I use Astaroth's line as an example, I didn't once see his other childer as being related to me. Sure we had the same sire but for no reason other then we'd all paid our dues at the Hall of Binding. I think only one or two of his childer at the time had been turned from human to vampire by him. So why would I treat his childer as my brothers and sisters when we shared nothing? No dna, no rudimentary blood connection.. nothing. I didn't even take his last name as my own.
*shakes his head, chuckling softly*
Folk need to remember that we ain't human so can't use human values and labels to explain or justify our actions. I'm sure someone is gonna pipe up about adoption but once again, that's a human thing. I mean honestly.. if we were indeed human then no authority in the world would be placing children in our care and seeing as how most folk in this city are well over the age of 16, adoption wouldn't even be considered.
So, as far as I'm concerned, it ain't sibling rivalry it's just plain ol' jealousy. There's gonna be different reasons for it and for that, yer'll have to look inside yerself.
*winks in the direction of Kurayami*
I'll bet most jealousy comes from the ol' Oedipus Complex...
*shoves his hands deep into the pockets of his too-tight black jeans and saunters off, whistling softly*
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Jaenelle
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D'dary Egoist[C01:0058A9]
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Post by Jaenelle on Nov 15, 2008 15:31:28 GMT -8
I like him. *Nods at Bambi* And I most definetly agree, those vampires that cling to human values annoy me, and the whole 'mummy (mommy)' 'daddy' thing irritates me. Why would you tell your parents? If your old, then they are probably dead. If your young, well, if you complained to Mummy, and she yelled at you, who knows, you might end up ripping her throat out to prove a point. Your vampires for crynoutloud, you ARE older than children, you are not babies. As for having childer that hate one another...well that makes life a little less boring, why not find something and pit them against one another. Either they continue scrapping and fighting, or they could possibly accept their differences and move on. But then again, this is Ravenblack City, such a complex concept is hard to grasp. Pity.
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