Damia
New Member
Posts: 186
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Post by Damia on Oct 3, 2009 18:31:42 GMT -8
*Hazel eyes had skimmed this periodically, curious as to what both sides thought of this. She herself had a few ideas on what she thought but she chose to keep silent since her views would be nothing new nor would they present discussion unless of course she chose to be stubbornly rude like one or two in here. For most the conversation she nodded and read quite willingly as it was quite broken down. Jada and Moons covering both sides while dragonet and a few others chose to break it down even more. But there were a few statements she did not like and so in that she chose to speak.*
"Hairbair you mention Archangel, who killed younglings in his clan as a means of illegitimate war. And yet I don't remember seeing you around. Your point while perhaps valid because that is what caused me to leave AA oh so long ago, overlooks a bit of history that there were other reasons for that war and Im sure any others Archie chose to hold. Of course I have nothing but absolute and utter disdain for the man but then I remember what he did to my friends, a few of those younglings that you so causally toss around in your argument and family. So until you know the full history on somethnig perhaps you should research properly first. For every war waged in this city has reasons. Bad, good and ugly. There are many that an outsider not in the war can sit and say are wrong or horrible. But then there is always the reasons simmering beneath the pot that no one sees until after the fury has died down.
As for your disrespect for Boomer, I have found the lady to be nothing but gracious in my many years in this city. True she is neutral and yes she does tend to have an opinion on quite a bit. But at the same time I don't see where she has earned such famed hostile comments from one such as yourself. Though I have been gone for a few years, so perhaps Boomer ran around pretending to HW you or your family and I missed that.
Next on this issue of spying, I think you have established quite properly that Kaelani did bad and spies are bad. What amuses me is that some of the best spies in this city have done this before and were successful. And yet they are looked at perhaps even fondly for their exploits because they got away with them. It is only when the spy is caught that many rush to disclaim them and say they are horrid. I myself dislike spies but in this fight while its quite all right for L'inconnu to zero her as they did catch her. I actually find it quite surprising her family is claiming her, because most would rush to separate themselves from one quick enough, espicially if the spying were for them. So obviously the lady must have one or two good traits to have her family so obviously supporting her.
As for the rest of this discussion, I think the lady Jada, Moons and Black have it well in hand. And my regards to those for their wonderful break downs of both sides. For it helps those of us who look towards the middle to see the truth and find it.
And I do apologize to you Hairbear if it seems I am picking on you. But I dislike to read a worthy reading and have it torn apart by someone who seems to not know their history and also with such hostility towards one who made one comment and then left this conversation.
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Damari
New Member
[C01:Yellow]
Posts: 1,410
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Post by Damari on Oct 3, 2009 18:54:59 GMT -8
God - I didn't read any of that cause the blue is just terrible.
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Mephistophlese Sinclair
New Member
?True leadership must be for the benefit of the followers, not the enrichment of the leaders.?
Posts: 364
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Post by Mephistophlese Sinclair on Oct 3, 2009 20:35:53 GMT -8
Inasmuch as your words of wisdom Black_dragonet, when you start spilling your blood on the streets of Raven Black City, I will consider your thoughts about war.
black_dragonet hasn't spilled his blood in war? Are you kidding me? He lost tens of thousands just this past year. But he was prepared to spend a million coins to gain it back. OK, my numbers could be off, but my point still stands.
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Damia
New Member
Posts: 186
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Post by Damia on Oct 3, 2009 20:49:02 GMT -8
God - I didn't read any of that cause the blue is just terrible. Oh I would hate to offend others with my color.
*Smiles sweetly at the computer as she changes it just for Damari.*
But I'm not sure Lime green is my color...hmmm
Teal's quite pretty but again, it fails to express me, *Clicks another one* Oh brown is so dull, maybe this ..color? Oh thats just not me, no I think I'll have to stick to blue as it fits me. But thank you Damari for making me consider other colors.
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Josephine
New Member
~Eternally..~
Posts: 269
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Post by Josephine on Oct 3, 2009 20:53:19 GMT -8
Damari is right, that blue is horrible... Sorry it hurts even my eyes.
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Moons
New Member
Posts: 863
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Post by Moons on Oct 3, 2009 20:57:32 GMT -8
I like blue, but pink or white would be better.
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hairbear
New Member
Venimus Atque Infernum Nobiscum
Posts: 320
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Post by hairbear on Oct 3, 2009 21:01:22 GMT -8
My disrespect for Boomer? Ha! Boomer who has her childe succour to her so he can HW others. That neutral Boomer?
I lost 40k in blood to protect younglings from fighting Damia, oh that's right you wouldn't know about that because you weren't around.
My own childe was thrown out into the fray. Fight or be crypted were ArchAngel's exact words. My childe didn't even have 1/2 of his powers at the time. No coins but he was expected to fight.
I do not disagree with your point about wars. Every war has it's reason and this one is not an exception. I said that earlier. The truth will come out. I have pieced together many conversations held over the last few months and I have a pretty good handle on what the truth is.
No one in this war is related to me. No one. I would consider a few friends, a few acquaintances and the rest only names I recognize in the newspaper. My argument is not based on personal feelings for one family/clan or another but on honor.
Throwing names and history out does not give you a pass. I could care less how long or how short someone has been in the city. Some of the most noble vampires I've met are not fully powered. Judging others on that basis boggles my mind.
Damia, I could care less what your personal opinion about me is.... it matters not. I have been around much longer than you think. I tend to keep to myself unless I perceive an injustice. I have nothing to gain and everything to lose with expressing my thoughts.
***********************************************
Mephistophlese, Miranda corrected me about Black_dragonet and I apologized for my mistake. Like I told him, I have never claimed perfection nor will I ever rise to that status. I am much to flawed for that.
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Post by black_dragonet on Oct 4, 2009 1:09:56 GMT -8
Meph is right, last war cost me over a million in Necro. Funny thing is the bank wouldn't let me withdraw it at once. Well, they ended short one employee that day. When others spoke of me, she rescinded her statement and apologised, so to me this matter is entirely closed.
I wish we would concentrate on the strategy analyse of this war.
More precisely, I would very much like to know how it is possible that clan L'inconnu stands alone in this war, without allies or almost. I would like to know how it is that leaders could be zeroed in the first days of a war.
It seems there are more Dumonts than L'inconnu warriors, and that difference is growing as days pass, since I see more L'inconnu casualties than Dumont casualties. Even though L'inconnu warriors have proven themselves in battle, they do not seem to fight as fiercely as in the last war. Is it because they do not have enough leaders anymore? Is it because they have been given orders to not fight more than necessary? I would not want to make wrong assumptions...
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Tifereth
New Member
Because some people have short memory.
Posts: 472
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Post by Tifereth on Oct 4, 2009 8:16:30 GMT -8
Let me answer that for you, black dragonet.
No. We're not going to fight more than necessary. We're not going to spend our time, coin, and blood on them--would you, in our place? Would you waste your resources on someone who attacks during negotiations, attacks the fallen even when they're not even participating in battle, insult, backpedal, backstab, lie, attempt to publically humilliate you? Would you waste your time and resources in someone who tells you one thing and does another, disregarding the respect and honor that an enemy should be shown in war? We sure as hell won't.
It's not that we can't win this war. It's merely that we -won't-. They are not worth the effort. They are a passing thrill. A battle is a battle, regardless of who you're fighting against, and it should be fought--as it will be. We defended ourselves after being attacked with no reason whatsoever (not that they needed one, mind you) and that is all. Whatever lies, whatever "strategy", whatever derisive comments they make is their problem---yesterday night, they lost all remnants of respect we might've had for them.
Now, I should be shaking in my little warrior boots because they're going to send Koz to zero me again. But, alas, I'm not---this will be over soon enough, and blood is nothing to me but means to an end. Their excuses mean nothing to us, and neither do them, really.
Yes, "pasing thrill" is all there is to them.
Alas, I hope this answered your question, black dragonet.
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Post by Surenitee on Oct 4, 2009 8:43:24 GMT -8
*Applauds behind her screen before she types* Oh, well said, Moons. -Very- well said. *rolls her eyes* On behalf of L'inconnu: We have not ever planned, plotted, edged toward or schemed any offensive assault, nor have we in any other way provoked an attack from the Dumont family line. We -have-, however, had numerous reports, some confirmed then, and all of them confirmed now, obviously, of such an attack being plotted against us. As stated elsewhere, the Dumont line and this assault means very little to us in general, but we will fight back when attacked. We will not, however, allow this spin-fest to continue without answer. Kaelani's attempt at "spying" as you call it, was little more than an information-gathering Fail. If her inept attempts boosted your family's morale, well then, more power to you. Killing her was our retaliation and punishment for broken trust. It has been said several times now that this was an appropriate response, as we felt it was from the start. Spying happens, but that does not mean we take it lightly when one is caught. Although we're still wondering where you found these supposed "battle plans"...Hm. Right. Anyhoo! As for our warriors. It is good form to congratulate one another on a job well-done and to be respectful to one another. All of our fallen have been treated with respect and given well-wishes from enemies, friends, clanmates and the public alike - for the most part. For that, we say thank you. However, your one-sided views of our fighting are not only rather skewered, but it seems like someone is whining a bit that he hasn't been given enough attention. *winks* Surely that can be remedied. L'inconnu's combative warriors have fought consistently, and hard, each night. But, again (seriously, does this need to be spoon fed to you?) we aren't all too concerned with giving this much more effort than that. When we are engaged in a live battle, we fight. As has been evidenced by the "Patchworks'" dropping blood levels, and with our own. Moving on... We also find it rather amusing that you in one breath say we must be broke, and in another speak of our contract with the Splinters. In addition, you call into question that some of our members knew about the contract and others did not. Well. To address the latter first - does your leadership share all of its planning with the rest of the family? No? Does any clan or bloodline do this? Because if you do...get me a spy in there! Oh wait...we don't need one. Your family hemorrhages information. Of the former: We hired the splinters to help mop up some of the mess rather than dirtying our own hands. Boy, you Dumonts and friends sure do like to fight dirty. What was that part about a rather publicly outspoken "neutral" acting as a succour point for her little man again? Riiight. How's that working out for you, Boomer? That neutrality thing? Another thing we would like to mention here, just as an aside - it was clear in a previous post that you, Moons, wanted to keep the numbers "mysterious," correct? Either Kaelani messed up (again) or you simply can't count. In other words, that number may be a little...off. Please do not interpret that as us being upset you stated the numbers, but jeebus, man. At least get it right. Well. For now, we've stated our piece and hope some of your questions and thoughts have been addressed. As you said, Moons...the truth comes out in the end. I'm sure that will be the case here, as well. Comments and opinions from the public are welcome, but our actions in prior battles have been addressed before and picked apart then, and we find the re-hash and rather uninformed opinions of those battles to be pointless. That was war - we were called upon for assistance, and we gave what we gave. This, however...well, you can call it whatever you like, but us? We will continue to yawn and swat at the flies as we see fit. Thank you. Hm. On which part must I start the correcting? Firstly: If this war meant very little to you, it is shown in your leadership that letting your clan members fall on your own selfish feelings is just as bad as the clan in itself. Secondly: Ace shares every ounce of information with me, and I am not in a leading position in this family. I am just here. So yes, he does tell me everything he has going on. Thirdly: There has been numerous amounts of times where the Dumont family were given tips that your clan were either planning the zeroing of the head of our family, or planning a war on our family. And we, as a whole, were sick of talking. Fourthy: All your warriors have done that deserve congratulating, is kissing up to your rears. They do not show honor at all when it comes down to a battle against a family you clearly don't care about. Infact, one of your fallen is quite bitter, and your leader, the day he had fallen, allowed his other half to send out a message about how angry he was to begin with. Such bitterness and anger doesn't come with simply... 'not caring'. Fifth: You're surrounding this entire battle on one tiny detail: Kaelani spying. Yes, Ace made a mistake with this, but, that is not the entire reason the Dumonts are fighting your clan. And to honestly think or believe that is stupid in itself. There has been issues between you two for how long? The Dumonts vs. King Lestat, Lyric, Louvain, Tifereth. Is that what you would rather? Because either way, your clan would have jumped in, thus causing a war. Either look at the bigger picture, or shut your mouth. In all honesty, there is no honor in fighting your clan. The outter-comments from people not involved mean very little to us as we continue in this fighting. We are not the first to allow our allies to fight along side us, nor will we be the last to do so. You have shown how immature and frankly, how sad it is to fight this clan. And for that, I think we should call a victory on our half and end this. But I am not the leader. "Do not be disrespectful to us, do not say we did this that or the other thing, but watch us while we do the same thing to you! HAHAHA! See how we did that?! WE'RE GOING TO BE DISRESPECTFUL TO YOU, BUT YOU CAN'T DO IT TO US." I rarely say things like this, but frankly, if you can not learn what war is all about, then you don't deserve to call yourselves warriors, so either grow up, or shut the fuck up.
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Ace Dumont
New Member
Tulip King[C01:FFCC00]
Posts: 263
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Post by Ace Dumont on Oct 4, 2009 9:36:08 GMT -8
Re: "whatever remnants of respect we might've had." I lost that about the time I saw so many bodies wandering around and coming here to flamebait us about five minutes after we got through zeroing them.
As for the rest; as usual, and as 100% expected, you'll latch onto any excuse for your loss. Not surprising in the least. End result is still the same. Your Clan falls, within a matter of days, and you're left to pick up the pieces. I don't care what you want to bitch about at this point, I'm well aware most of the L'in have been bitching about us for months before we started kicking you around. Now you at least have a reason to be bitter. You're welcome.
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Jada
New Member
I will only complicate you...
Posts: 144
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Post by Jada on Oct 4, 2009 12:35:28 GMT -8
I am so happy that you see fit to interpret our stance in such a way. As stated many times now, our clan members and family are fully aware of this stance. Everything else you've said is your opinion on this situation, which does not make it fact. Oh, and as for knowing everything about everything? That's why we heard about your plans quite some time ago. Did we care then? No. Do we care now? No. But someone in your family is a very leaky little bidet. Might want to find that and fix it, no?
You all speak of dishonour and disrespect - but you've been nothing but both of those things. We have two warriors who do not rest. They do not throw weapons for two weeks after they are taken to zero and one of them refrains from most public comment. Regardless, you've decided how they will spend their two weeks and thrust it upon them. What would you do if we attacked a torporing vampire on your side? Because some of our members do not agree with torpor? Well, I imagine you'd throw some major public hissy fits and and those vampires would come out of torpor and fight again. Such hypocrisy! *shakes her head as she types*
What war is about, you say? I'm sorry - but have I seen you on the battlefield, Surenitee? Oh, no? Then I guess it would stand to reason that you have absolutely no idea what war is about, except from a scholarly *tries not to laugh as she types that* point of view. War is many, many things, to be certain. But you cannot have a clue as to what it is if you are not actually fighting in one. And, as I said before...if you want to call it a war just because your, er, LEADER...has decided to declare one, well, that's your choice. We still see it as an unprovoked attack that we are defending as we see fit. We refuse to acknowledge such disrespectful and childish behavior any longer. Ace has shown himself and his minions to be hypocrites, liars and oh yes, I'll say it - cheaters.
Frankly, dear, it is you who should close his mouth. You sound flat-out ridiculous.
As for you, Ace. *she smirks* We are not making any excuses. It has been clear from the beginning that you are yawn-worthy opponents, though certainly high in number. Bitter? Not in the least. Disappointed that we do not have honourable opponents? Yes, I would say so. We acknowledge that we are outnumbered and will take the loss with grace, but do not think it will be taken without defense. Even so, we've certainly had some fun spilling some blood, watching ours be spilt, and it was a great way to kick back and play. So we thank you for the good time, at the very (and I do mean very) least. It's just a shame that you and yours cannot retain some sense of decorum and respect for your enemy, or follow the same rules you claim to unlive by. When it comes to respect, it matters not who wins or loses, it is still possible to be worthy opponents and respect another's good show on the field. And again, I'm not too sure where your intel came from, but you haven't been a blip on our radar except for the reports that you've been planning an attack against L'inconnu and it's leaders for ages. We've got more interesting people to play with, though. Sorry if that hurts your...er...feelings.
So. In light of the above, it is not possible to show respect for your "Patchwork" any longer, not after you have shown your true colors. From calling in supposedly neutral parties for assistance, to constantly refusing to honor how another vampire chooses to spend his or her two weeks after a zero, to attacking while discussions are occurring, you have proven nothing except that you are unworthy of our attention. Therefore, from the moment after this statement is made, L'inconnu will have no further public comment on the matter except to comment in our fallen warriors' obits. I think our stance has been made clearly enough by now - but I'll say it again, one more time -
we do not care for your delusional little play for social status and we will not acknowledge you except to defend ourselves when we are attacked - L'inconnu Light, if you will.
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Andre
New Member
Silhouette's Shadow
Posts: 190
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Post by Andre on Oct 4, 2009 12:37:21 GMT -8
You're saying a lot for someone that's not supposed to care. Just my two cents.
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Ace Dumont
New Member
Tulip King[C01:FFCC00]
Posts: 263
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Post by Ace Dumont on Oct 4, 2009 12:41:15 GMT -8
Blah blah blah "We're losing so we're going to claim we don't care." Like I told you yesterday, when I made it very clear no cease fire was coming, we'll finish you and your mouth a bit quicker if you step to the left. Then to the right. It's not a hard concept to understand.
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Moons
New Member
Posts: 863
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Post by Moons on Oct 4, 2009 12:42:43 GMT -8
You're saying a lot for someone that's not supposed to care. Just my two cents. I'm glad I'm not the only one to see it. Nice block party earlier, by the way.
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